EFTA00009448.pdf

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT 
SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA 
IN RE: OPERATION LEAP YEAR 
Federal Grand Jury, 07-103 
West Palm Beach, Florida 
February 27, 2007 
APPEARANCES: 
, ESQUIRE 
Assistant United States Attorney 
Foreperson 
TESTIMONY 
OF 
• 
ORIGINAL 
Cam I (9617 
EFTA00009448

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The sworn testimony of 
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was taken before the Federal Grand Jury, West Palm 
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Beach Division, West Palm Beach, Palm Beach County, 
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State of Florida, on the 27th day of February, 2007. 
, Court Reporter, was authorized to 
and did report the sworn testimony. 
EFTA00009449

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(The witness entered the grand jury room.) 
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having been duly sworn by the grand jury foreperson, 
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was examined and testified on her oath as follows: 
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EXAMINATION 
6 
By 
7 
Q 
Good morning, special agent 
Could 
8 
you restate and spell your name for the record. 
9 
A 
It'S 
10 
11 
Q 
Can you remind the grand jury who you are 
12 
employed by? 
13 
A 
The FBI. 
14 
Q 
I know that you testified here a few weeks ago. 
15 
Was there anything from that testimony that you wanted to 
16 
correct? 
17 
A 
I did. I was asked by one of you Mr. Epstein's 
18 
age, and I confused him with another individual in another 
19 
one of my cases. His birthdate is January 20, 1953. We 
20 
are looking at the time period of 2004 and 2005. So 
21 
Mr. Epstein would have been about 51 or 52-years-old, and 
22 
I believe I told you he was 45. So at the time we're 
23 
looking during this investigation, he is 51 or 52. 
24 
Q 
Agent 
how did this case first come 
25 
to the attention of the police? 
Co-h f01, 13 
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A 
In March of 2005, 
our youngest 
2 
3 
4 
5 
the town of Palm Beach. 
6 
7 
A 
8 
9 
identity, correct? 
10 
11 
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A 
lives in the 
21 
area here in Palm Beach County. 
22 
Q 
At the time, in 2005, what school was she 
23 
attending? 
24 
A 
25 
Q 
What year was she in school? 
identified victim -- her 
called the Palm Beach 
police department and reported that she believed that her 
stepdaughter had been molested by a male that resided in 
So today we are going to talk about 
IP 
Yes. 
And we are using her initial to protect her 
A 
Yes. 
Q 
Can you tell the grand jury 
III date of 
birth? 
A 
birthday is 
Q 
And you mentioned that the call came in from 
in March of 2005, correct? 
A 
Yes. 
Q 
So how old was 
at that time? 
A 
She was 14. 
Q 
Where does 
live? 
( 
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A 
She was a ninth-grader there. 
Q 
You mentioned that her 
called the 
Palm Beach police department. What did the police 
department do in response to that call? 
A 
They wanted to interview 
the next day they went out to where 
school at that time, which I think was 
. I believe it was 
was attending 
. They 
interviewed 
at 
and wanted to get her side 
of what took place. 
Q 
Because we'll be referring to this throughout, 
what was the name of the detective who conducted that 
first interview? 
A 
Detective= 
So in March of 2005, detective 
talked with 
. Was 
ever interviewed at any other times? 
A 
Yes. She was interviewed -- they talked to her 
again. She placed some controlled calls for them later 
that month, we will talk about that later. As well as 
she was interviewed about a year later in July of 2006. 
Not interviewed, but she testified before the grand jury 
for the State of Florida. So she was interviewed by 
detective 
in March of 2005, and then about a year or 
three or four months later, in July of 2006, she testified 
before a grand jury with the State of Florida. 
25 
Q 
In preparation for your appearance today, did 
(Ertl (06(3 
EFTA00009452

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you have a chance to interview 
? 
2 
A 
Yes, I did. 
3 
Q 
And when was that? 
4 
A 
Last night. 
s 
Q 
Back in March of 2005, you mentioned that 
6 
detective 
met with 
on or more than one 
7 
occasion? 
8 
A 
Yes. 
9 
Q 
If you could give us sort of an overview of what 
10 
reported during these interviews, and then if there 
11 
are specific discrepancies or differences, we will return 
12 
to those later. 
13 
A 
All right. On February 5, 2005, it was a 
14 
Saturday, and 
I. was at 
house, 
I. She 
15 
was there with her boyfriend, 
I. And because these 
16 
are minors, we'll refer to them without using their last 
17 
names, so I'll use those initials. 
18 
They were at 
residence, and 
I. is 
19 
boyfriend, which is also 
cousin. So they 
20 
were all at 
house, and 
was on the phone with 
21 
an individual that 
refers to as the assistant. 
22 
described the assistant as a tall blonde. 
23 
So throughout I'll refer to her as the blonde lady, if 
24 
that's okay. 
was unable to recall her name. So 
25 
is on the phone with the assistant for Jeffrey 
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Epstein. 
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and 
overhear 
on the phone 
3 
describing 
describing 
to the lady on 
4 
the phone. So when 
gets off the phone, 
and 
5 
both want to know why 
was being described to 
6 
this lady on the phone. 
becomes upset when 
7 
asks 
if she would like to go to Palm Beach and give a 
8 
man a massage that she knows. 
agrees, and this 
9 
upsets 
, and an argument ensues where 
and 
10 
go into the bathroom and they argue outside the presence 
11 
of 
12 
Q 
Let me stop you there. Was 
supposed to be 
13 
paid for giving this massage? 
14 
A 
Yes. 
told 
that she would be paid 
15 
$200 or $300, I believe. 
16 
17 
18 
19 
20 
21 
22 
have known what 
was doing for this man and the work 
23 
that 
did for Mr. Epstein, and that is why 
was 
24 
so upset. 
25 
0 
So 
knew that this wasn't just a regular 
You mentioned that 
is 
, and 
is also 
correct? 
A 
Yes. 
Q 
What was 
idea about why they were 
arguing? 
A 
She has told us that she believed that 
must 
CArei  ( 
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massage that was going to take place? 
A 
Yes. 
Q 
So 
and 
have this argument. What does 
decide to do? 
A 
decides to go. 
Q 
Because she wanted to make the $200 or $300? 
A 
Yes. 
Q 
So tell us then what happened after that 
meeting? 
A 
The next day, February 6 -- they discussed that 
evening about going the next day. We do have on 
phone records two calls that were placed. One was placed 
to 
cell phone, and the other was placed to 
Jeffrey Epstein's residence the night of February 5. 
The next day 
is contacted a couple of times 
before 
arrives. Each time prior to 
being 
contacted by 
a call is placed by 
to 
cell phone. 
, I should tell you, is 
Jeffrey's assistant. 
So on Sunday a call was placed to 
and then shortly after that a call was made to 
. That 
same series occurs again, but this time 
places a 
call to Mr. Epstein's residence, and then 
is called 
again. 
Eventually, 
comes to 
residence with 
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another girl in the car, 
I* So the two of them 
2 
arrive at 
residence, and they continue over to 
3 
Mr. Epstein's house. 
4 
Q 
is driving with 
and 
. Do you 
5 
know how they were sitting? 
6 
A 
You know, I'm not sure how they were sitting, 
7 
but I know that it was a pickup truck that 
drove, 
8 
and 
was the driver. I'm not sure exactly the 
9 
placement of the other two girls, but they were in the 
10 
truck. 
11 
Q 
And 
was able to describe how they travelled 
12 
to the island of Palm Beach? 
13 
A 
Yes. She gave directions -- you know, the best 
14 
that she could on how she was able to come to 
15 
Mr. Epstein's residence. 
16 
Q 
Once they arrived at the residence, what 
17 
happened? 
18 
A 
I should have mentioned that either the night 
19 
before or the day of, there were some things that 
20 
tells 
. One, she tells 
that she is to tell, if 
21 
asked, that she is 18-years-of-age, that she attends high 
22 
school, that she's in the 12th grade, and I believe it was 
23 
that she was to say that she went 
24 
to. 
25 
Talking to
■ last night, 
told us that 
Celt-) (l b 13 
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once she arrived at the residence 
tells her that she 
may possibly be asked to take her clothes off. She also 
tells her that she can stay in her bra, but she may be 
asked to take her clothes off. And 
told us last 
night that that's when she knew for the first time that 
she might have to possibly remove her clothes. 
At this point they proceed to enter the 
residence. 
describes him as a security person. He 
approached and asked what they were doing there, and 
said they were there to see Mr. Epstein, or see Jeffrey. 
He allowed them entry into the kitchen area by the pool, 
and 
describes that area. So now 
and 
are all sitting in the kitchen. A short time goes 
by and Mr. Epstein, as well as the assistant, enter the 
kitchen. 
Q 
And I know that you mentioned that 
did not 
know the name of the lady who was there in the kitchen, 
correct? 
A 
Right. 
Q 
She just described her as a blonde, tall lady? 
A 
Yes. 
Q 
Was 
also interviewed about what happened 
that day? 
A 
She was interviewed by the Palm Beach police 
department. 
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Q 
Did IM 
identify the person who was on the 
2 
phone with her as IIIII 
3 
A 
Yes, she did. 
So even though IIII doesn't know her name, IIIII 
5 
knew 
name? 
6 
A 
Yes. 
7 
Q 
So you mentioned that the three girls are in the 
8 
kitchen, along with Jeffrey and the person 
calls the 
9 
blonde lady? 
10 
A 
Yes. 
11 
Q 
What happened then? 
12 
A 
follows the blonde lady upstairs to 
13 
Mr. Epstein's bedroom. The blonde lady proceeds to take 
la 
out a massage table and set it up, prepare it. She also 
15 
takes out some lotions to be used during the massage. 
16 
told me last night that the blonde lady asked her to 
17 
remove her clothing, and then left the room and said that 
18 
Mr. Epstein would be in shortly. 
19 
Q 
What happened after she left the room? 
20 
A 
Shortly after that, Mr. Epstein does come into 
21 
the room and shakes 
hand. 
told us last night 
22 
that Mr. Epstein told her to remove her clothing. He 
23 
leaves the room and comes back in just a towel, and he 
24 
tells her again to -- she is at that point -- when he 
25 
walked in the first time she had on her bra and her pants. 
ct 3 
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When he comes back in, he tells her that she needs to take 
2 
her pants off. So she took her pants off. So now she's 
3 
4 
Q 
At some point did 
tell any of the people 
who interviewed her what was running through her mind? 
6 
A 
She stated at one point that she was upstairs 
7 
with him, with the man, and that 
was downstairs. I 
8 
guess she says, "What could 
do? She's downstairs, 
9 
10 
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laying on the table, he has a towel covering his bottom, 
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and she is straddling him with her bottom touching the 
25 
towel and some skin touching his lower back. She was kind 
in her bra and underwear. 
I'm upstairs." So she did what she was asked to do. 
Q 
So now you mention that Mr. Epstein is here 
wearing just a towel, and 
has removed both her shirt 
and her pants, is that correct? 
A 
Yes. 
Q 
Tell us what happens then? 
A 
Mr. Epstein gets on the massage table lying on 
his stomach and instructs 
how to do the massage. He 
tells her to put some lotion on her hand and instructs her 
on how to actually perform the massage. At one point 
during the massage he tells 
that she would be more 
comfortable to get on top of him, so 
gets on top of 
him and straddles Mr. Epstein's back. 
The way 
describes it is Mr. Epstein is 
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of sitting -- it sounds like sitting on his rear end, but 
2 
with part of her skin touching him -- the front of him, 
3
but he had a towel across his bottom. 
4 
Q 
What happens as she is providing the massage to 
5
his back? 
6 
A 
The massage goes on. She said the entire 
7 
massage lasted anywhere from 30 to 45 minutes. At one 
8
point Mr. Epstein excuses himself for a few minutes, one 
9
or two minutes briefly. 
states that she can hear 
10 
Mr. Epstein 
, and states that she 
11 
believes he was, in her words, 
12 
She didn't say 
she said 
. 
13 
I am going to use that she believes he was 
14 
15 
Then he returns. At this point he gets back on 
16 
the table lying on his back and asks her to start 
17 
massaging his chest. So she begins to massage his chest. 
18 
Q 
Does he keep the towel on? 
19 
A 
No, at this point the towel is removed. when he 
20 
comes back and he gets back on the table, the towel is 
21 
removed and she is massaging his chest. 
22 
Q 
What does he do as she is massaging his chest? 
23 
A 
He 
. So he 
24 
on the table. He asked 
, at 
25 
some point during this time, if she would like to make an 
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extra $100. He tells her that it would not involve doing 
2 
a massage. IM 
agrees. He asked her if he could 
3 
and she does agree. 
describes it as 
o 
a 
5 
said this goes on for about ten minutes. 
6 
At some point during that massage 
8 
9 
10 
11 
and she 
describes hinIMMM 
Q 
What did she say happened when Mr. Epstein 
IMMMEB 
A 
The 
. At some point he does 
12 
. And these are her words. She 
13 
looks at him kind of funny, and he sarcastically -- which 
14 
is her word -- he sarcastically says, 'What's the matter?" 
15 
And she at that point just kind of looks away, and he 
16 
continues on with 
. In the last 
17 
three to four minutes of that, he 
18 
19 
At the conclusion of the sexual activity, 
20 
Mr. Epstein 
was 
21 
asked if 
She 
22 
but saw him 
23 
Q 
Was 
able to provide a physical description 
24 
of Mr. Epstein? 
25 
A 
Yes. 
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Q 
Including of 
? 
2 
A 
Yes. 
3 
Q 
Was she also able to provide a description of 
4 
her surroundings in that massage area? 
5 
A 
Yes. 
6 
Q 
Was that description accurate? 
7 
A 
Yes. According to other testimony we have 
8 
gotten from other victims, yes. 
9 
Q 
And a search was performed on Mr. Epstein's 
10 
house? 
11 
A 
Yes. The Palm Beach police department did 
12 
perform a search, and several of the items that were 
13 
described were found in the house. 
14 
Q 
After Mr. Epstein 
what 
15 
happened? 
16 
A 
He told 
that she was getting the extra 
17 
hundred dollars because he was allowed 
18 
. The massage had been 
19 
concluded, the sexual activity had been concluded. He 
20 
gets up and leaves for a brief moment of time and comes 
21 
back with $300 and pays 
the $300. I believe he told 
22 
that she could see herself out. 
23 
Q 
Before we leave that room, when 
was either 
24 
being directed to the room or was inside that room where 
25 
the massage took place, was there anything in particular 
Ceerti, I 0-6 
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that she noted seeing? 
A 
She noted seeing several naked pictures of girls 
in the room, a mural or pictures of naked girls either 
exposing their breasts or completely naked. 
Q 
While the massage was going on, did Mr. Epstein 
talk to 
A 
Yes, he did. 
Q 
And did he talk about sexual conquests with 
girls? 
A 
Yes, he did. 
Q 
Once Mr. Epstein has provided 
with the 
$300, what did she do? 
A 
She went back downstairs and she, 
and 
leave the residence. In the car they ask 
how 
much money she has made, and she tells them $300. 
wants to see the money. She shows the money to 
, and 
asks what did she do. At that point 
tells her 
that he 
Q 
When they left the house, where did they go? 
A 
When they left the house, they were on their way 
to a mall to go shopping with the money that they had 
received from Mr. Epstein. 
had told 
the night 
before that she needed some shoes and wanted to go to the 
mall, and she was going to Mr. Epstein's to pick up some 
money. That was another reason that she had for going to 
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Mr. Epstein's house that day, and that they were going to 
2 
go shopping after she got her money, and that MI could 
3 
make some money. 
4 
Q 
During that ride, did 
realize that ME 
5 
received money from Mr. Epstein? 
6 
A 
Yes. At some point 
knows that 
7 
received $200, but is unsure that 
ever gave a 
8 
massage. So at that particular time 
did not know why 
9 
she had gotten the S200, because she didn't think that 
3.0 
had had time to give a massage. 
11 
interview, did she explain what:she 
12 
got the $200 for? 
13 
A 
told the Palm Beach police department in 
14 
her interview that she received her $200 for bringing 
15 
to the house. 
16 
Q 
You mentioned that there were these three 
17 
different time periods that 
was interviewed: Shortly 
18 
after the events, at the time of the state grand jury 
19 
proceedings, and when you met with her, correct? 
20 
A 
Yes. 
21 
Q 
And there were some discrepancies between the 
22 
different interviews. Can you explain some of those to 
23 
the grand jury. 
24 
A 
Before we go and get to that, I want to make 
25 
sure that -- when we discussed what 
was told in the 
e.er-72-t, (rat -3 
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car byllill, that we learned from ME 
interview with 
2 
the Palm Beach police department. So I don't know if I 
3 
said that, but I want to make sure you know that we first 
4 
learned that= 
by listening to the 
interview that was conducted between the Palm Beach police 
6 
department andillill, not fromilill. When I talk later, I 
just want to make sure you realize that that had not 
8 
initially come out in 
interview, but through the 
9 
interview with 
10 
So going back. I'm sorry, discrepancies? 
11 
Q 
Yes. 
12 
A 
I met with 
last night to discuss some of 
13 
the discrepancies when looking at what she had talked to 
14 
detective 
about in March of 2005 and what she had 
15 
testified to in the grand jury in July of 2006. Reading 
16 
the testimony and listening to the tapes, or reading the. 
17 
transcript, there were a few discrepancies. 
18 
One of the first ones we talked about was what 
19 
had told her about going to Mr. Epstein's house. 
20 
She tells detective 
that she was told about the 
21 
massage, told about getting $200, but that she was not 
22 
told that she would have to take her clothes off. She 
23 
didn't know she would have to perform the massage naked. 
24 
when I asked her last night that question, she 
25 
told me that when she got to the house prior to going into 
 
alaNCI2WINCII 
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Mr. Epstein's residence, that I= 
did tell her that she 
2 
may be asked to take off her clothes. She also did state 
3 
that 
told her she could stay in her bra. 
4 
So I wanted you to know that there was a 
5 
discrepancy in what she originally had told detective 
6 MI and what she told me last night. That would be one. 
7 
The second discrepancy i wanted to touch on with 
8 
her was going upstairs and taking off her clothing. When 
9 
she is in that room, she states to detective 
that 
10 
asked her to remove her clothing, and she took off 
11 
her shirt. Then Mr. Epstein came in the room, shook her 
12 
hand and told her to take off her clothes. He leaves, he 
13 
comes back in a towel. He tells her again. 
tells 
14 
detective 
in a stern voice, 'Mr. Epstein told me to 
15 
take off my pants." Because she hadn't taken off her 
16 
pants from the first time that she met him. 
17 
In her testimony with the grand jury with the 
18 
state, she tells the grand jury that it was 
who 
19 
asked her to remove her clothing. So last night we went 
20 
over with her who told her to remove what. She had a very 
21 
hard time recalling exactly. She knew she had gotten down 
22 
to her bra and underwear. And then at some point, when 
23 
we're going through the sexual activity, she actually 
24 
tells me that her underwear was off when he was 
25 
&API") N't O 
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Later in the interview, we tell her about what 
2 
we have in her testimony to the grand jury and her 
3 
statements made to detective 
And she really is 
4 
having a difficult time trying to remember who told her to 
5 
take off her clothes and her pants. As we are walking 
6 
through the sexual activity, she does recall and states. 
7 
that it was Mr. Epstein who told. her to take off her 
8 
pants. 
9 
I guess I'll go to the third discrepancy. Is 
10 
there anything I left off with that? 
11 
Q 
Well, does she report that when the assistant 
12 
leads -- or the blonde lady leads her upstairs, that the 
13 
blonde lady also said, "Get undressed," but that 
14 
didn't get fully undressed? 
15 
A 
That's what she said in her statement to the 
16 
detective, when she gives her first statement. She tells 
17 
us again last night that that's what she recalled. 
18 
Q 
That the lady said first, "Get undressed," but 
19 
she doesn't get fully undressed. And when Jeffrey comes 
20 
back, he said, "Take your pants off."? 
21 
A 
Yes. And again, like I said, when we started 
22 
interviewing her and asking her about this, she did have a 
23 
hard time. But when we were walking through the sexual 
24 
activity, that's when she recalls who told her to take off 
25 
her pants. 
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And I'll tell you, when we talked about the 
sexual activity, and it comes out that she wasn't wearing 
her underwear when 
, she does not recall how they came off. 
She cannot remember removing her underwear. She doesn't 
remember if Mr. Epstein removed her underwear. She knows 
her underwear was off, but she cannot tell you exactly at 
what point her underwear was removed. 
Q 
Let's talk about the third discrepancy. 
A 
The third is the sexual activity, when she was 
originally interviewed by detective 
about the 
When detective 
comes and sees her again a few weeks later, she does 
tell her at that time that 
She also says that to the grand jury, she talks about the 
Last night she told us about 
When we asked her about hiM 
and that 
had told the police 
department that she 
told us last 
night that she 
by Mr. Epstein, but that she 
thought only her and 
knew about this and that she 
did not want her father to know that 
She didn't want anybody to know, but she especially didn't 
25 
want her father to know, that that was her business. That 
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she did not know that 
had told anybody, she thought 
2 
it was only her and 
that knew. She was embarrassed 
3 
and didn't want anybody to know that. 
4 
Q 
Did she become visually upset? 
5 
A 
Yes, she began crying when we asked her about 
6 
. when she realized that we 
7 
knew about that, she became very upset and concerned about 
8 
her father. She mentioned that her father has read a lot 
9 
of the reports in the State of Florida, and has followed 
10 
the state's case. She was concerned about even telling 
11 
us, afraid that he would be able to read in our reports 
12 
about this. 
13 
We explained to her that the FBI's reporting is 
14 
a little bit different than the way the state -- those are 
15 
public records, and ours is part of our case file. 
16 
Q 
In addition to the fact that she had these 
17 
concerns about her father and she was embarrassed, in your 
18 
experience of interviewing victims of sexual abuse, is it 
19 
typical for them to not disclose all of the sexual 
20 
activity? 
21 
A 
Yes, it's very typical. And young girls, they 
22 
don't want to talk about it. This is just another case of 
23 
her not wanting to tell exactly what took place. 
24 
Q 
After that first visit to Mr. Epstein's house, 
25 
and the interviews with detective 
, did detective 
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1 
Q 
On April 1, the following day, did illilmake 
2 
calls to 
3 
A 
From the Palm Beach police department, they were 
4 
able to take voice mail messages left by Mon 
5 
phone stating that 
could come and work on Saturday 
6 
around 11:00. 
7 
Q 
I think you mentioned this 'last time, but in 
8 
case you didn't, did the Palm Beach police department do 
9 
trash pulls at Mr. Epstein's house? 
10 
A 
Yes, they did. 
11 
Q 
Was there anything of value related to this 
12 
series of calls that were recovered? 
13 
A 
Yes. There was a trash pull done in the 
14 
beginning of April, and in the trash there was a piece of 
15 
paper that on it had 
name, 
name, and I 
16 
believe it was 10:30 listed on the piece of paper. 
17 
Q 
It said 
with 
on Saturday at 10:30? 
18 
A 
Yes, it did. 
19 
Q 
In addition to the actual recordings of those 
20 
phone calls and voice mail messages, do you also have 
21 
telephone records from both 
cell phone and 
22 
cell phone that match up? 
23 
A 
Yes. 
24 
Q 
Just to go back to something that you mentioned. 
25 
Who actually gave the $300 cash to 
at the day she was 
(„9-21 iqt) 
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Page 26 
1 
at Mr. Epstein's house? 
2 
A 
Mr. Epstein. 
3 
Q 
You mentioned a girl named 
4 
A 
Yes. 
5 
Q 
Was 
also interviewed? 
6 
A 
Yes, she was. 
7 
Q 
Was she asked about going With 
to take 
8 
girls to Mr. Epstein's house? 
9 
A 
Yes. 
10 
0 
Was she asked who the youngest-looking girl was? 
11 
A 
Yes. 
12 
Q 
What did she say? 
13 
A 
She discussed 
looking young in her 
14 
interview with the Palm Beach police department. 
15 
Those are all of my questions 
16 
for you now. If you could please step outside, I'll 
17 
see if the grand jurors have any. 
18 
(Witness excused, and then returned.) 
19 
BY■ 
20 
Q 
Agent 
, we have just a few questions. 
21 
One relates to the conversation between Mr. Epstein and 
22 
about his exploits with other girls. Did Mr. Epstein 
23 
say anything about the age of those girls? 
24 
A 
He said that -- in particular on one case he 
25 
talked about a young girl that he was in the back seat 
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Page 23 
NM 
ask MI to make what are called controlled calls? 
A 
Yes. 
Q 
Can you explain to the grand jury what a 
controlled call is? 
A 
A controlled call is where we actually have a 
listening device, where we have an individual place a call 
to somebody and we are able to record the other person's 
voice and the conversation that takes place between the 
person that we're having make the call and the person that 
they are calling. 
Q 
Who did detective 
ask 
to call? 
A 
was asked to call 
on the phone. 
Q 
And did she do so? 
A 
Yes, she did. 
Q 
Can you tell the grand jury when the calls were? 
A 
I believe the first call was made towards the 
end of March, I believe it was March 30. 
called 
at the Olive Garden where 
works. 
was 
concerned that 
father had found out somehow and 
that they knew about it. And she refers to him as 
Jeffrey, but Mr. Epstein. 
told her that they did not know about 
Mr. Epstein. Later in the conversation 
tells her 
that Mr. Epstein would like her to come back and work for 
him, and that maybe she could work for him tomorrow. So 
koly3 
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1 
they agreed that there would be a call between 
and 
2 
tomorrow, that 
will call 
tomorrow. 
3 
Q 
were there calls also made on March 31 of 2006? 
4 
A 
There were two calls made on March 31. The 
5 
first one she doesn't connect to 
. The second call 
6 
that was made a short time later, 
answers the phone. 
7 
Again, there is a discussion about 
coming to work for 
8 
Mr. Epstein. 
tells 
-- one of the comments that 
9 
is made is, "The more you do, the more you make." 
is 
10 
asking her how much can I make. 
11 
Again, detective 
is there, and 
is 
12 
, how much can I make.
asking 
is telling 
13 
that she'll have to ask Mr. Epstein that, that she is 
14 
going to see Mr. Epstein tomorrow and that she'll talk to 
15 
Mr. Epstein. There is conversation about 
and her 
16 
twin sister possibly coming to Mr. Epstein's house. There 
17 
is some discussion about her coming to work for 
18 
Mr. Epstein. 
19 
Q 
Just so it's clear, because there were a lot of 
20 
shes, 
is telling 
that 
is going to see 
21 
Epstein the following day? 
22 
A 
Yes. 
23 
Q 
And that 
is going to set up a schedule 
24 
with Mr. Epstein for 
and her sister to work for him? 
25 
A 
Yes. 
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Page 27 
1 
with, and her parents were in the front seat. He told 
2 
that they were having sex in the back seat 
were 
3 
doing sexual things in the back seat while he was carrying 
4 
on a conversation with the parents in the front seat. I 
5 
guess they were on their way home from a business party. 
6 
This was one of the stories that he had talked about. 
7 
Q 
But at no time did he provide any specific ages 
8 
about any of those girls? 
9 
A 
No. 
10 
Q 
what was 
age at the time she took 
11 
to Mr. Epstein's house? 
12 
A 
She was 18. 
13 
Q 
Did Mr. Epstein ask 
anything about her age? 
14 
A 
He did. He asked her how old she was, she said 
15 
she was 18. He asked her what grade she was in, she said 
16 
she was in the 12th grade. He asked her where she went to 
17 
school, and she said she went to 
18 
Q 
I know we will be doing a lot more discussion 
19 
about 
later. But could you tell us briefly how 
20 
was recruited to go to Mr. Epstein's house? 
21 
A 
was at the beach, and two individuals 
22 
approached her about making money and giving a massage to 
23 
Mr. Epstein. 
24 
Q 
How old was 
25 
Mr. Epstein's house? 
when she first went to 
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1 
A 
Through phone records, we have contact between 
2 
and 
starting at age 17. 
3 
: Those are all the questions. 
4 
Thank you. 
(Witness excused, and then returned.) 
BY 
7 
Q 
The question was, was there any particular 
evidence to suggest that Mr. Epstein knew that 
was 
9 
under the age of 18? 
10 
A 
I would say through the interviews of the 
11 
multiple girls that went to Mr. Epstein's house -- the way 
12 
that having seen 
last night, and now she's 16 -- this 
13 
was two years ago -- that 
age and behavior -- and 
14 
again, is that more circumstantial evidence? As far as 
15 
concrete evidence, no. But just by her appearance and her 
16. 
mannerisms and how I observed her last night at age 16. 
17 
Q 
And that's consistent with what 
said 
18 
during her statement; correct? 
19 
A 
Yes, it is. 
20 
MS. 
: Any other questions? 
21 
JUROR: 
Did she look 18? 
22 
THE WITNESS: Does 
look 18? Not in my 
23 
opinion, sir. 
24 
MS. 
: All right. Any other questions? 
25 
Okay, thank you, very much. 
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(Witness excused.) 
CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 
I CERTIFY pages 1 to 28 is a true transcript of 
my shorthand notes of the testimony of 
before the Federal Grand Jury, West Palm 
Beach, Florida, on the 27th day of February, 2007. 
Dated at West Palm Beach, Florida this 18th day 
of March, 2007. 
Philip W. May, Court Reporter 
Urriit9g(7 
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